Options & Opinions Wanted

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 1:22 pm

What is the best for indie bands/labels...

1. Make music availble free as mp3 download and hope if they like they will buy the c.d also.

2. Stern warning against downloads, they have to buy the c.d.

3. Sell paid downbloads, hope they pay or donate and don't bother with c.d's at all.

Other options/ideas?

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 2:35 pm

For Indie Bands, I assume exposure is your goal first and foremost. Offer a few songs at low rate mp3's for download, tour tour and tour some more, and for the album, I've seen success with special packaging, pictures of band members, lyrics, etc. in the cd booklet, and extra songs put on the vinyl edition of the album. Occassionally release cd / 7" singles, with non album/rare songs. And definitely have a decent website with a forum for fans to gather and ask questions.

assholitis · Post by **assholitis** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 3:56 pm

Put out an album with 12 (or however many songs are on it) great songs! Seems simple enough, but that's sort of a rarity for an album. What keeps me from buying a band's album is when I sample the record I find that there's maybe only two or three songs I like, and sometimes just the band's single is good. In addition to Poor Man's suggestions, I say just simply make an entire album full of good songs and then put up 30 second samples of each song on your website so the listener can get a taste of how good the album is.

-Kevin

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 4:15 pm

POOR MAN!!!!!!!!?! hahaha!

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:23 pm

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:37 pm

Let's be realistic; it's fairly hard to put out an album with '12 great songs'.
That seems like saying, Want to lose weight? It's easy! Don't eat.

Of course, there's a few classic albums that seem great all throughout, but those are relatively rare. As long as you can be consistently good (a few really good songs per album), you don't need to have an album with 100 percent 'good' songs, i believe.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 6:41 pm

a KROQ spy! wrote:For Indie Bands, I assume exposure is your goal first and foremost. Offer a few songs at low rate mp3's for download, tour tour and tour some more, and for the album, I've seen success with special packaging, pictures of band members, lyrics, etc. in the cd booklet, and extra songs put on the vinyl edition of the album. Occassionally release cd / 7" singles, with non album/rare songs. And definitely have a decent website with a forum for fans to gather and ask questions.

touring can also be a hard issue - although I am with you on this, the reality is the c.d's I am fininacing this from my work so at the moment 2 weeks tops (my vacatiom) unless the situation changed.

Does anyone really buy vinyl?

Is that paid download thing i.e Napster, I tunes actua;;y work or do people expect it free.

Ive been watching how the bigger bands do it and it seems they all have a different strategy.

The Bravery for example you can download the single from myspace, other bands dont do this.

Also I am advertising with some music mags, any feedback. Does this work> Is it worth it.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 6:43 pm

assholitis wrote:Put out an album with 12 (or however many songs are on it) great songs! Seems simple enough, but that's sort of a rarity for an album. What keeps me from buying a band's album is when I sample the record I find that there's maybe only two or three songs I like, and sometimes just the band's single is good. In addition to Poor Man's suggestions, I say just simply make an entire album full of good songs and then put up 30 second samples of each song on your website so the listener can get a taste of how good the album is.

-Kevin

I know what you mean Kevin. I get bothered too. Even if I think I have 12 great songs does that mean anyone else wll think so?

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:00 pm

Glenn wrote:
a KROQ spy! wrote:For Indie Bands, I assume exposure is your goal first and foremost. Offer a few songs at low rate mp3's for download, tour tour and tour some more, and for the album, I've seen success with special packaging, pictures of band members, lyrics, etc. in the cd booklet, and extra songs put on the vinyl edition of the album. Occassionally release cd / 7" singles, with non album/rare songs. And definitely have a decent website with a forum for fans to gather and ask questions.
touring can also be a hard issue - although I am with you on this, the reality is the c.d's I am fininacing this from my work so at the moment 2 weeks tops (my vacatiom) unless the situation changed.

Does anyone really buy vinyl?

Is that paid download thing i.e Napster, I tunes actua;;y work or do people expect it free.

Ive been watching how the bigger bands do it and it seems they all have a different strategy.

The Bravery for example you can download the single from myspace, other bands dont do this.

Also I am advertising with some music mags, any feedback. Does this work> Is it worth it.

When I speak of Indie bands, I'm speaking of local bands like the Von Steins, the Smut Peddlers, 400 blows, the Bronx, Throwrag, Flogging Molly, etc. Most/all of these bands had a way to get songs from the internet, and mostly, for free. I don't think there would be much of a benefit for charging for songs (itunes, etc.) for a new band.

Believe it or not, there's still a niche market for vinyl. A lot of record nerds will collect albums and 7"s for bands like the Melvins, White Stripes, and just about all the aforementioned bands.

Ads in magazines? I don't think they help. But, I do believe getting interviews in mags like flipside, max rnr, etc.. etc..DO help. When I read a magazine, I'll actually read the interviews; the ads just seem to blend together in the back. Sometimes it's nice to get a big review as well.

Also, if I were in a band, I'd contact a known poster artist and try and work something out. Poster artists I've seen usually make for good word-of-mouth about your band/album..'Oh yah, I've heard of that band'..etc. Usually you can arrange for the poster artist to keep some of the prints, you get some, and the poster artist will sell their copies to pay for printing costs/etc.

I'd ask some of the friendly local bands I've mentioned about specific advice; just about all of them are very friendly and would probably have some more good advice for you.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:25 pm

thanks spy (ha ha I used to share a rehersal studio with Smut Peddlers)

Just your opinion, and anyone else who wants to chirp in.

This is realistic situation -

Option A)

release 4 song e.p on c.d (this is my original plan)

or Option B)

release the 4 songs as free mp3's + vinyl 7" or something specialty to sell + maybe make t-shirts etc.

p.s what is poster artist? Someone who designs posters I suppose?

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 8:19 pm

Ahaha, it seems like everyone..and I mean that literally..you'd be surprised how many people know the Smut Peddlers one way or another. Did you hear about their cancelled European tour? Very sad. I love that band.

You might try contacting John, or Julia from the Smuts about which to release. I think the vinyl release might be cheaper, although I think most magazines want cds to review. I don't have a strong opinion either way.

poster artists , aside from the obvious, have a strong connection to local bands as well as big time bands. Try hanging around gigposters.com for a while; very helpful people hang around there, experienced artists (people who have been making gig posters for a long time) and up-and-comers. Some of the printers print silkscreen posters as well as shirts, you might be able to kill two birds with one stone.

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 8:47 pm

Actually I havent heard anything about those guys in a while...beyond they got pretty big. I don't follow the scene though as much as I should. What happened with the Euro Tour?

We rented a pratice studio in Redondo Beach and they had the room accross the aisle and 2 doors to the right. Sometimes they woud come in and watch them practice and sometimes we would go to their room and watch them practice. They where very new & so where we, that being The Fondled.

After practice we would go to "The Dolphin", yes the gay bar next door for $3 pitchers. Our singer was a mighty lesbian and our friends would all cruise in and jam money into the jukebox. My friends used to tease me about how I would grab the handle bars in the bathroom. Some jokes never go away. That is the kind of bar I would in with $5 in my pocket, drink all night...and leave with $20 in my pocket. God knows how.

We played a few shows with them also. After one show at the Congo room a buch of Venice Beach gangsters where trying to beat me up so I had to hide in the bed of my friends truck. It was pretty bad. Of course I had no clue what was going on at the time. Big mouth strikes again.

Are they all the same members?

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:04 pm

If I remember correctly, John was talking to a magazine based out of Germany, saying how a lot of so-called punks follow a code of behaviour that isn't much different than the establishment they usually are against..that these "punks" will get a mohawk aka a punk uniform, spout leftist political slogans..and basically don't think for themselves. (warning: this could be completely off the mark) . Well, the german interviewer said, hey! we are a leftist organization! Got offended by what John said, made some calls, and had the european promoter pull their european tour.

I think some of the original members are gone.

It's funny, I've been in the hospital; the guy next to me says, 'Hey, have you heard of the Smut Peddlers?'..very strange.

They played a show in Huntington Beach a few years ago at..damn, can't remember the club..anyways, a few gang bangers/skinheads/whatever showed up and tore up the place.up. Next time I was at the club, I asked about it; the guy pointed to the huge busted window and said 'that's because of them.' I think Julia wrote about it, said her tires got knifed that night.

Venice always seemed super sketchy/dirty to me, especially at night. I think I'd rather be in downtown l.a. than venice at night. Although they used to have a few good records stores down there, like Penny Lane. que sera

assholitis · Post by **assholitis** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 1:31 pm

Well, since Chuck Roast thinks it's impossible to put out an album with all good songs, how about this - just make it so that there's more songs that you listen to and enjoy than the number of ones you skip over. Even that is a rare find these days. Or, I like your idea, Glenners. Just make an album with nothing but songs that you love and are truly proud of. Like you said, it's hard to gauge what the general public will think and whether they'll agree with the songs you've made, but I think if you really put your heart, time, and talent into it then it will come across. You can usually tell when bands/labels put out manufactured crap or an album with two radio singles and 10 "filler" songs.

I hope my few suggestions help in some way. And I hope more people start replying to this thread so you can get more ideas!

-Kevin

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 1:56 pm

thanks kev

obiwankobe · Post by **obiwankobe** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 2:42 pm

I'd take the tracks you have, rename them all "Hollaback Girl" and flood the file sharing networks! You will be able to introduce your music to a new audience that probably wouldn't have heard it.

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:12 pm

obiwankobe wrote:I'd take the tracks you have, rename them all "Hollaback Girl" and flood the file sharing networks! You will be able to introduce your music to a new audience that probably wouldn't have heard it.

That idea is bananas! B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:13 pm

a KROQ spy! wrote:Let's be realistic; it's fairly hard to put out an album with '12 great songs'.
That seems like saying, Want to lose weight? It's easy! Don't eat.

Of course, there's a few classic albums that seem great all throughout, but those are relatively rare. As long as you can be consistently good (a few really good songs per album), you don't need to have an album with 100 percent 'good' songs, i believe.

Now you're either Dr. Drew, Adam, or just an avid love-line listener and it's rubbed off on you....

assholitis · Post by **assholitis** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:28 pm

Yeah, really. He was one step away from asking Glenn who abused him as a child.

-Kevin

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:36 pm

*Annie* wrote:
a KROQ spy! wrote:Let's be realistic; it's fairly hard to put out an album with '12 great songs'.
That seems like saying, Want to lose weight? It's easy! Don't eat.

Of course, there's a few classic albums that seem great all throughout, but those are relatively rare. As long as you can be consistently good (a few really good songs per album), you don't need to have an album with 100 percent 'good' songs, i believe.
Now you're either Dr. Drew, Adam, or just an avid love-line listener and it's rubbed off on you....

Glenn, I hear a 'little girl' voice..have you been touched inappropriately??

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:39 pm

jeez louise

MicheBel · Post by **MicheBel** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:40 pm

I tell you what. If it's a band I'm not familiar with, they damn well better give me the first one free.

There is some band, don't remember who now, but I went to their website (linked from Mr. Shovel's handy dandy Check One Two page), played some of their music, and it was like they played the first few bars, then it cut off. I promise you, I'll never buy any music from that band.

My feeling on the whole thing is that you gotta trust people. Give 'em a few good free downloads, hook 'em, they'll wanna buy more of your stuff. I have never believed that corporate hogwash about if it's available free, people won't buy it.

Whether it's music or movies or software or whatever, if I can get it easily free, I often do, but when it comes time to upgrade or a new CD comes out, or whatever, I'll shell out cash. Or, I'll turn other people onto it. In the long run, a few free downloads are worth it.

If the band is snotty, and only has things for BUY BUY BUY, I go to the next band's page.

And also you have a MySpace thing, with a link to your website, where it's EASY for them to purchase lots of not only CDs, but band gear. With a list of where you're playing too, so they can pay money and see you. Make it easy for them to purchase stuff if they want, but opt out if they want too.

Hey, also, places like iTunes offer free downloads often (you might wanna ask Larry about this, he's way on top of it). So maybe you could hook up with them, and become one of their featured "free" bands? Then if people like you, they could buy the four-song CD?

--Miche

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:42 pm

Thanks Miche, I tend to agree.

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:14 pm

a KROQ spy! wrote:
*Annie* wrote:
a KROQ spy! wrote:Let's be realistic; it's fairly hard to put out an album with '12 great songs'.
That seems like saying, Want to lose weight? It's easy! Don't eat.

Of course, there's a few classic albums that seem great all throughout, but those are relatively rare. As long as you can be consistently good (a few really good songs per album), you don't need to have an album with 100 percent 'good' songs, i believe.
Now you're either Dr. Drew, Adam, or just an avid love-line listener and it's rubbed off on you....

Glenn, I hear a 'little girl' voice..have you been touched inappropriately??

"A,B,C,D,E,F,G....."

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:17 pm

assholitis wrote:Yeah, really. He was one step away from asking Glenn who abused him as a child.

-Kevin

"What do you do, Glenn"

"Uh, well... RIGHT NOW.... I'm trying to put a CD together with my band..."

"Uh-oh... 'right now'..."

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:32 pm

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:33 pm

Have you beeen drinking Annie?

obiwankobe · Post by **obiwankobe** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:35 pm

she must be, or she was at the crack house all day like Friday

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:36 pm

She's on a ROLL!

Don't slow her down!

Go Annie!
Go Annie!
It's yer Birthday!
Go Annie!

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:39 pm

Glenn wrote:Have you beeen drinking Annie?

"Are you on any medication or drug?"

"...uh....No."

"Not taking any drug prescribed by a doctor?"

"....uh....No..... I'm just taking Prozac and Zoloft"

"Okay, those would be prescribed drugs!"

".....Oh..... And i smoke weed too."

"Nooo! Never would have guessed!"

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:43 pm

Hee hee.

Junior college? Junior college? Are we going to take bets?

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:45 pm

Junior college, and he works in construction.... probably lays some carpet!

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:46 pm

p.s. Annie, did you ever hear the episode when the phone sex girl called in; Adam if she'd ever heard of the Holocaust, she said No; so Adam asked her to work in the word 'Holocaust' into a pretend session of phone sex? Very very funny.

MicheBel · Post by **MicheBel** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:49 pm

Good luck to you, Glenn. The music biz is tough out there.

Course, maybe if you're real nice to Mr. Shovel, he might play one of your tunes.

--Miche

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:49 pm

"what are you doing?"

"mmm... nothing... I was just thinking about the holocaust..mmm..."

hahaha, the holocaust made her all hot!

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:53 pm

MicheBel wrote:Good luck to you, Glenn. The music biz is tough out there.

Course, maybe if you're real nice to Mr. Shovel, he might play one of your tunes.

--Miche

thanks Miche,

Although I love writing music I have no real expectations. If it makes just a few people happy i'm fine. I ain't exacrtly counting on it to make a living that's for sure. That's what your 20's are for.

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 4:53 pm

Ahaha, that was great..Adam kept laughing after she said that.. I think Tom Arnold was there as well, cracking up..

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:00 pm

Yeah... it was hilarious! I also like DAG's sexual re-enactment... when he falls asleep at the end??? hahahah

P.S. "Bouncy, bouncy!"

MicheBel · Post by **MicheBel** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:01 pm

Glenn,

If there's one thing I know in my old age, it's to aim high. If you love doing something, just keep doing it, and dream for the moon. You just never know. Especially in this town.

Especially with the folks in this very forum who may have connections who can help you...

--Miche

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:10 pm

*Annie* wrote:Yeah... it was hilarious! I also like DAG's sexual re-enactment... when he falls asleep at the end??? hahahah

P.S. "Bouncy, bouncy!"

Don't You look at Me!

DON'T YOU LOOK AT ME!!

DON'T YOU LOOK AT ME!!

***snores snores****

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 5:33 pm

*Annie* wrote:
assholitis wrote:Yeah, really. He was one step away from asking Glenn who abused him as a child.

-Kevin
"What do you do, Glenn"

"Uh, well... RIGHT NOW.... I'm trying to put a CD together with my band..."

"Uh-oh... 'right now'..."

What's so funny about that???

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:59 pm

Glenn wrote:
*Annie* wrote:
assholitis wrote:Yeah, really. He was one step away from asking Glenn who abused him as a child.

-Kevin
"What do you do, Glenn"

"Uh, well... RIGHT NOW.... I'm trying to put a CD together with my band..."

"Uh-oh... 'right now'..."
What's so funny about that???

"Tee Hee" *giggles like schoolchildren" Runs away screaming INSIDE JOKE!

assholitis · Post by **assholitis** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 11:00 pm

Glenn wrote:
*Annie* wrote:
assholitis wrote:Yeah, really. He was one step away from asking Glenn who abused him as a child.

-Kevin
"What do you do, Glenn"

"Uh, well... RIGHT NOW.... I'm trying to put a CD together with my band..."

"Uh-oh... 'right now'..."
What's so funny about that???

Annie's playing Lovline with Rikki Rachtman.

-Kevin

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:15 am

Ssssh! Shhhh!!!! Quiet everyone!

....is that-?... Did I just hear a smoke detector go off in the background?!

a KROQ spy! · Post by **a KROQ spy!** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:49 am

..but..Good Times, right?

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:15 am

Good times....

"Tonight, on CBS, in order to save these kids, Hack will have to become ... a RAPIST!"

obiwankobe · Post by **obiwankobe** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:19 am

obiwankobe · Post by **obiwankobe** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:19 am

Glenn · Post by **Glenn** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:25 am

obiwankobe wrote:

dynotmite!!!

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 3:27 pm

I miss the Loveline inside jokes...

assholitis · Post by **assholitis** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:32 am

*Annie* wrote:I miss the Loveline inside jokes...

I like when Drew sniffs out a fake caller. lol He's so good at it. I dunno how he does it sometimes. One time this girl in high school called and claimed to be a nympho. After like 2 minutes Drew knew she was BS'ing. So Adam asked what kind of guys she's slept with and she's like, "um...like the football team." haha Total bullshit answer. Is that the most generic answer ever? Sheesh!

-Kevin

*Annie* · Post by ***Annie*** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:54 am

Sometimes i wish they would play along to the bogus calls more... instead of bursting my bubble...

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